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North Korea & South Korea

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49 minutes ago, mbs said:

i find it very good also surprised because north Korea doing something good that rare af

i mean im pretty sure Kim Jong Un agreed to meet with Donald Trump

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7 hours ago, Jerry Hat Trick said:

Reunification would be a bit difficult, I think.

I can't see Kim Jong Un willing to give up the position he holds, which he would obviously have to do in case of reunification.

While I may be wrong, those in positions like this are wont to give them up.

IF this were to happen, however, I could see him negotiating for a place within the prevailing government, which would likely be that of South Korea.

The Kim dynasty is still responsible for some of the most notable violations of human rights in recent decades. It's not easy to just put that behind and keep him in some form of power.

 

Reunification has other problems, anyway. It's been over seventy years since the split, and the two states became increasingly distant from each other in factors such as culture, values, and prosperity. Polls are also showing that younger South Korean generations are becoming less open to the idea of reunification, or at least they aren't caring as much for the prospect.

 

Compare and contrast with the German reunification in 1990, which was a similar scenario with less extreme circumstances. The two German states reunified in less time, with the differences in the previously mentioned factors being significantly less severe than what we see on the Korean peninsula today. Almost twenty-eight years after the fact, the former territory of the GDR is still struggling to catch up.

 

Korean reunification is going to be beautiful, yet so ugly.

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Achievements

I think for Korea to unify, the world is going to need to forgive many people who violated human rights. That must be the first step to reunification. The US did that with Japan after WWII and it brought out the good in some people to never commit such atrocities again. It might have been for the strategic location during the cold war, but it worked. I'm sure they could use the same excuse with China being communist and all that.

18 hours ago, -_Fx_- said:

I starting laughing when kim waddled over the border. He walks really funny.

here u go

CfnTQpg.gif

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Its part of Kim's plan to improve his countries economy.
Kim now has working confirmed nuclear capability, this move isn't as much reunification but fixing the Norths famine and economic problems.
As his first stage is complete he now has a hand never brought to him before for his father and grandfather, a title of nuclear power,  the only reason this has happened is to relieve sanctions by the US and NATO on N Korea's trade and exports. South Korea is practically agreeing to deescalate the tension between both nations, I mean, only a short time ago Kim fired a Missile over Japanese airspace If this was before they had nuclear capability, it would be taken as war with Japan, as a foreign offensive object entered un-warned into another states airspace. 
9 times out of 10 with a non nuclear power, this would be taken as offensive operations and a state of war would be declared

Japans humans rights Violations which were mentioned before are exempt as a lot of the proof given to their evidence were burned, and many failed to come to light due to either the victims being dead, or only eye witness accounts were available.
N. Korea's violations are world widely known, punishment is unavoidable, however as every neighbor of the Korean peninsula wants no conflict, its most likely they will be exempted.
(That'll piss off human rights activists) 

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I don't know, part of me thinks it's a political stunt to rise what's left of NK's reputation, but at the same time, they have been fighting for decades concerning peace and unity. It is quite possible we'll eventually see a reunification of the Koreas (which has been and still is the most right thing to do) in the near future. I'm on the fence, but I'm leaning slowly and slowly towards the reunification.

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On 5/2/2018 at 2:03 PM, Shuruia said:

The Kim dynasty is still responsible for some of the most notable violations of human rights in recent decades. It's not easy to just put that behind and keep him in some form of power.

Not like the US/Nato have a good record either, North Korea aren't the good guys but I don't remember North Korea bombing children in other countries, invading other countries, over throwing other countries leadership or committing acts of terror against their own citizens for political gain.

 

On 5/3/2018 at 1:54 AM, Lean said:

The US did that with Japan after WWII and it brought out the good in some people to never commit such atrocities again.

The US killed more civilians than Japan, you know about the nukes but what about the fire bombing of civilians in Tokyo where kids were burned alive, far worse than rogue soldiers raping and executing Chinese, the US still occupy Japan to this day to the disdain of most of the Japanese population and US soldiers in Japan don't have a clean track record with even the US covering up for them.

 

On 5/3/2018 at 1:54 AM, Lean said:

It might have been for the strategic location during the cold war

Of course it was for strategy, the US have meddled with Japan's politics for decades before WW2, do you really think the US give a shit about these supposed atrocities? The US never intervened until Pearl harbour and don't care when one of their allies do the same thing (Britain in WW2, France's terrorist attack on NZ, Israel's genocide of Palestinians, Saudi Arabia bombing kids)

 

On 5/5/2018 at 8:21 AM, Harakoni said:


Japans humans rights Violations which were mentioned before are exempt as a lot of the proof given to their evidence were burned, and many failed to come to light due to either the victims being dead, or only eye witness accounts were available.

Exempt? You do you know that Japan still have US occupation and laws in place from the end of WW2 not to mention the millions of civilians killed by america in Japan, the hundred of thousands POWs killed by americans oh sorry "suicided" Japan still aren't allowed to have a proper military and while they haven't asked I doubt the US would fuck off Japan if they were asked to and as you said there is little proof of Japan's war crimes.

 

On 5/5/2018 at 8:21 AM, Harakoni said:

(That'll piss off human rights activists) 

North Korea has done far less bad than American, I don't remember North Korea bombing children, killing their own citizens for political purpose (not talking about killing/arresting of activists/opponents but murdering people in a false flag), invading dozens of other countries and over throwing leaders of countries.

 

North Korea's atrocities are mostly starving their own people partially due to sanctions placed by the US/Nato, if the US spent half the money they spent on the military that is focused on North Korea alone they could feed the entire country but instead they'd rather bully North Korea (and any country that goes against their world view) for that matter.

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3 hours ago, Malal said:

Exempt? You do you know that Japan still have US occupation and laws in place from the end of WW2 not to mention the millions of civilians killed by america in Japan, the hundred of thousands POWs killed by americans oh sorry "suicided" Japan still aren't allowed to have a proper military and while they haven't asked I doubt the US would fuck off Japan if they were asked to and as you said there is little proof of Japan's war crimes.

Japan is under US occupation because Japan and the US are very close allies, not primarily because of their defeat post WW2. The US-Japan demilitarization act was created to halt any conquest of Asia Japan may undertake again.
Yes, laws do exist to halt excessive militarization of the country, but that was in fear, as i said before, of a re-creation of Japans WW2 conquests (Just a side note, the JSDF was actually deployed under NATO and UN Peacekeeping duties in the past 5 years, to countries such as Iraq and Syria.)
If you are going to bring up America killing Japanese POW's, you can't. The duty of an Imperial Soldier was "Death Before Dishonor", They would die before they surrendered. Which meant if they were captured, a VAST majority committed suicide within POW camps, for fear of scorning.

3 hours ago, Malal said:

North Korea has done far less bad than American, I don't remember North Korea bombing children, killing their own citizens for political purpose (not talking about killing/arresting of activists/opponents but murdering people in a false flag), invading dozens of other countries and over throwing leaders of countries.

North Korea has committed a "silent" genocide within it's borders, 70% of the population have near nothing to eat, and if anyone questions the Kim family, they're killed for treason.
I'm going to stop you right there on the NATO needs to fund food point. Looking at the Global economic system, which country gets it's ENTIRE food supply from abroad? Near zero. The sanctions are justified, not because NATO wants to "starve" the DPRK, but because the Kim family redirected funding to MILITARY expansion.

Where you say the US has bombed children, can you say where? (I know about Dresden, and other WW2 cities, but that was near 80 years ago)

America doesn't kill it's own citizens for political purposes, that's conspiracy theory talk, and can you also say who and why, if you are going too? Because i have absolutely zero knowledge of any events like that.

Also, does "Totalitarian Dictatorship" and "World Relations" ring a bell? American deployments may be questionable, but usually have a reason, Vietnam was to halt the expansion of Communist North Vietnam, as America was allied with South Vietnam, Korea was the same. The middle east was primarily to stop a dictator suspected of harboring WMD's. (Which was never proven, but the dictator had committed gross human rights violations towards his populace) 

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3 hours ago, Malal said:

Not like the US/Nato have a good record either, North Korea aren't the good guys but I don't remember North Korea bombing children in other countries, invading other countries, over throwing other countries leadership or committing acts of terror against their own citizens for political gain.

 

The US killed more civilians than Japan, you know about the nukes but what about the fire bombing of civilians in Tokyo where kids were burned alive, far worse than rogue soldiers raping and executing Chinese, the US still occupy Japan to this day to the disdain of most of the Japanese population and US soldiers in Japan don't have a clean track record with even the US covering up for them.

 

Of course it was for strategy, the US have meddled with Japan's politics for decades before WW2, do you really think the US give a shit about these supposed atrocities? The US never intervened until Pearl harbour and don't care when one of their allies do the same thing (Britain in WW2, France's terrorist attack on NZ, Israel's genocide of Palestinians, Saudi Arabia bombing kids)

 

Exempt? You do you know that Japan still have US occupation and laws in place from the end of WW2 not to mention the millions of civilians killed by america in Japan, the hundred of thousands POWs killed by americans oh sorry "suicided" Japan still aren't allowed to have a proper military and while they haven't asked I doubt the US would fuck off Japan if they were asked to and as you said there is little proof of Japan's war crimes.

 

North Korea has done far less bad than American, I don't remember North Korea bombing children, killing their own citizens for political purpose (not talking about killing/arresting of activists/opponents but murdering people in a false flag), invading dozens of other countries and over throwing leaders of countries.

 

North Korea's atrocities are mostly starving their own people partially due to sanctions placed by the US/Nato, if the US spent half the money they spent on the military that is focused on North Korea alone they could feed the entire country but instead they'd rather bully North Korea (and any country that goes against their world view) for that matter.

nice necro of a dead thread

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2 minutes ago, Jerry Hat Trick said:

You can hardly single out 1 person - did you notice the dates of the previous posts?

I see at least 3 others who did the same.

that's fair, i was wrong

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20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

Japan is under US occupation because Japan and the US are very close allies

Seriously? Sure if being forced to close allies at gun point makes them allies then sure they are very close allies, fact is most of the country believe they'd be better off without the US and want them to leave Japan.

9507e7694dce45548983ec0ad970001a_18.jpg

357241F900000578-3648872-image-a-13_1466

 

What kind of ally prevents their ally from rebuilding their military? Are you afraid of your ally not being dependent on you anymore?

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

The US-Japan demilitarization act was created to halt any conquest of Asia Japan may undertake again.

It was really to allow the US to occupy Japan and Japan unable to do anything originally, now it's used as an excuse to keep the military bases there.

 

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

Yes, laws do exist to halt excessive militarization of the country, but that was in fear, as i said before, of a re-creation of Japans WW2 conquests

And now? Japan is currently one of the most peaceful countries, there's no reason not to allow an ally to rebuild their military unless you have some sort of ulterior motive behind it

 

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

 (Just a side note, the JSDF was actually deployed under NATO and UN Peacekeeping duties in the past 5 years, to countries such as Iraq and Syria.)

300,000 members in a 120 million population country, you're also forgetting that they receive limited investment

The JSDF are just powerful enough to go on said peace keeping missions to look good in the news but not enough to justify the US leaving Japan.

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

If you are going to bring up America killing Japanese POW's, you can't. The duty of an Imperial Soldier was "Death Before Dishonor", They would die before they surrendered. Which meant if they were captured, a VAST majority committed suicide within POW camps, for fear of scorning.

The rate of suicide of Japanese POWs in American captivity was noticeably higher than that of other countries.

 

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

North Korea has committed a "silent" genocide within it's borders, 70% of the population have near nothing to eat, and if anyone questions the Kim family, they're killed for treason.

Genocide implies they're attempting to do it, they're not, it's due to incompetence and ignorance but the US/Nato have only made it worse with sanctions.

 

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

which country gets it's ENTIRE food supply from abroad? Near zero.

Pretty sure there are plenty of countries that do get most, not all but most from abroard, Vatican city, Afghanistan, Liberia, Chad, Central African Republic and Ethiopia to name a few.

 

Part of the reason for North Korea's food shortage is the geography of the country, it's not good for growing food at all.

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

the Kim family redirected funding to MILITARY expansion.

What's bad about this? Why is every country who try to build their own military (Iran, North Korea, Turkey, Libya) met with sanctions and threats of violence?

 

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

Where you say the US has bombed children, can you say where? (I know about Dresden, and other WW2 cities, but that was near 80 years ago)

Middle East https://www.thebureauinvestigates.com/stories/2011-08-11/over-160-children-reported-among-drone-deaths https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_drone_strikes_in_Yemen#2013

 

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

America doesn't kill it's own citizens for political purposes, that's conspiracy theory talk, and can you also say who and why, if you are going too? Because i have absolutely zero knowledge of any events like that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods

The US Government have been willing to kill their own citizens for political purpose before, the only thing that stopped this was John F Kennedy who was assassinated, did you know for Pearl Harbour to have been done by the Japanese so accurately it would be one of the most accurate attacks from a distance for the time, surprisingly no attack from the Japanese similar to it was ever shown, not to mention it was completely illogical for Japan to attack the US.

 

A lot of the evidence of these attacks have been hidden from the public or destroyed, the truth doesn't fear investigation

 

Hundreds of witnesses claiming things like 9/11 was set up, Pearl harbour was an inside job, corruption in the US government etc have wound up dead in sometimes mysterious ways, with no one held accountable for the murders most of the times or deaths being shrugged off as accidents/suicides.

Why do you think people like Edward Snowden were forced to flee to Russia for safety, or the illegal spying on Kim.com for his role in hosting mega, a semi-anonymous file sharing website.

A country that has killed millions of civilians in the past century and has the been biggest war monger and attempted to kill their own citizens for political purpose and only didn't thanks to a president who was assassinated surely wouldn't kill their own citizens to invade the Middle East right?

Same country that funded a terrorist group that they are now fighting.

If you really think the US are the good guys and are trying to stop evil, why have they done nothing about Israel and Saudi Arabias human rights violations all of which are far worse than what Libya was accused of doing without much substantial evidence of it.

 

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

Vietnam was to halt the expansion of Communist North Vietnam,

By murdering millions of Vietnamese citizens?  Sure worked out well with Vietnam becoming communist in the end and why halt the communist expansion, they weren't doing anything wrong, unless being an ally to the USSR is wrong.

 

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

, Korea was the same.

The Korean war has been in a stalemate for decades, there's no need for US troops in Korea.

 

20 hours ago, Harakoni said:

The middle east was primarily to stop a dictator suspected of harboring WMD's.

It was primarily for oil, he was suspected, you invaded a country on a suspicion.

You're also forgetting Syria, Libya, Yugoslavia and a few other countries.

20 hours ago, motorsteak said:

nice necro of a dead thread

It's not even a month old and I could see the thread from the front page.

Edited by Malal

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