Jump to content
 Share

DUSTY

The real Human vs Zombie discussion

Recommended Posts

If you read my first post about human vs zombie then consider that a solution to zombie inflating that was pertinent back when points were given for playing as a zombie. Right now, it's the worst thing imaginable to be selected as mother zombie. Nobody wants to play as one and instant spectating or afk is generally the result. Points as a zombie encouraged becoming one by either killing yourself or allowing to be knifed, which is where inflating came into play. What if points were turned back on, but only mother zombies get full points per kill while humans killed during the round get a fraction per kill like 1/5 the amount? I would really like to enjoy competing as a zombie once again and I know others would as well. If you take my suggestion of allowing you to choose which side you would like to begin a round as you can solve the issue of inflating while also getting people who actually try as zombie. The server was once at it's peak when you had people actually wanting to play as a zombie, and the human goal was to beat a map and not allow the zombies to get their points.

 

If you didn't read the first post...basically let people choose which side they want to play as where as you start as mother zombie if you want to accumulate points instead of killing yourself as CT and inflating that way. Let's go back to the days where you didn't dread being chosen as starting zombie while also making completing a map as a human more satisfying because zombies are actually trying and you still crouched under those lasers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Posted  Edited by DUSTY
8 minutes ago, Malal said:

Can't wait to choose to be MZ every round and take OP zm item and kill the entire team.

 

What's wrong with a zombie that's gonna try? Why not have CTs learn to stop these items? Would make for a better experience imo and be more gratifying when I take that screenshot after shutting you down. 

 

If there is a persistent issue why not allow admins the ability to turn the feature of choosing sides off for a map?

Edited by DUSTY

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


1 hour ago, DUSTY said:

 

What's wrong with a zombie that's gonna try? Why not have CTs learn to stop these items? Would make for a better experience imo and be more gratifying when I take that screenshot after shutting you down. 

 

If there is a persistent issue why not allow admins the ability to turn the feature of choosing sides off for a map?

There are certain items that used in certain spots can kill nearly the entire team with little to no way of countering

>If there is a persistent issue why not allow admins the ability to turn the feature of choosing sides off for a map?

Admins are not always on

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


5 hours ago, Malal said:

There are certain items that used in certain spots can kill nearly the entire team with little to no way of countering

>If there is a persistent issue why not allow admins the ability to turn the feature of choosing sides off for a map?

Admins are not always on

 

I wouldn't mind hearing which maps these are and then having a discussion whether to have the choose your side plugin active. If 3 maps are like that why generalize and discard the whole idea? The fact that admins aren't always on argument does nothing for me. If that's the case why even have the server open if someone's not always there to babysit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


50 minutes ago, DUSTY said:

 

I wouldn't mind hearing which maps these are and then having a discussion whether to have the choose your side plugin active. If 3 maps are like that why generalize and discard the whole idea? The fact that admins aren't always on argument does nothing for me. If that's the case why even have the server open if someone's not always there to babysit.

Minas, Westersand, Skyrim mainly.

52 minutes ago, DUSTY said:

If that's the case why even have the server open if someone's not always there to babysit.

False equivalence

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Wot the fock is going on, where the heck is the original post and the posts after it? Either way, I'm pretty sure I read the original post several times over, and it wasn't about how unappealing it is to play as a zombie, but requesting to be as zombie without inflating.

 

First of all, how am I supposed to believe you when you first ask for a mechanic to play as a starting zombie, then proceed to say that mother zombies are unfun to play as? Second, just because a few players do not wish to play as mother zombie doesn't mean that all players find it unappealing, and if it was like that, then we would have an issue where most or all mother zombies are going afk, which would be heavily noticeable. Third, the issue of mother zombie being unappealing for a few is completely separate from requesting to choose which side you start on. 

 

Lastly, inflation isn't tied down to points. Harder maps tend to have more people inflating. This is simply because certain players find it more appealing to play as zombie on those maps. It is already hard to win as a human on these maps, and having the right player in the zombie position pretty much ruins the entire session into a constant stream of losses. Then there are those who purposely wish to cause trouble for the majority, and those who just find winning as a zombie 9 out of 10 times more appealing than loosing as a human 9 out of 10 times. Letting these players freely choose to play as zombie is the equivalence of inflating, which like I said, has been an issue in the past.

 

7 hours ago, DUSTY said:

Why not have CTs learn to stop these items?

No,  just focking stop. There is nothing more cancerous than implementing something, consequences occur, and then blaming the playerbase or the admins for not playing in X manner and Y strategy.

 

39 minutes ago, DUSTY said:

The fact that admins aren't always on argument does nothing for me. If that's the case why even have the server open if someone's not always there to babysit.

Wait a second, I'm pretty sure that you were the one to suggest that if it becomes a persistent issue that admins should come and turn it off manually. Now it's boiled down to "we should have the mechanic, and close the server when admins aren't on"?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


12 minutes ago, gkuo88 said:

First of all, how am I supposed to believe you when you first ask for a mechanic to play as a starting zombie, then proceed to say that mother zombies are unfun to play as? Second, just because a few players do not wish to play as mother zombie doesn't mean that all players find it unappealing, and if it was like that, then we would have an issue where most or all mother zombies are going afk, which would be heavily noticeable. Third, the issue of mother zombie being unappealing for a few is completely separate from requesting to choose which side you start on. 

 

Lastly, inflation isn't tied down to points. Harder maps tend to have more people inflating. This is simply because certain players find it more appealing to play as zombie on those maps. It is already hard to win as a human on these maps, and having the right player in the zombie position pretty much ruins the entire session into a constant stream of losses. Then there are those who purposely wish to cause trouble for the majority, and those who just find winning as a zombie 9 out of 10 times more appealing than loosing as a human 9 out of 10 times. Letting these players freely choose to play as zombie is the equivalence of inflating, which like I said, has been an issue in the past.

 

No,  just focking stop. There is nothing more cancerous than implementing something, consequences occur, and then blaming the playerbase or the admins for not playing in X manner and Y strategy.

 

Wait a second, I'm pretty sure that you were the one to suggest that if it becomes a persistent issue that admins should come and turn it off manually. Now it's boiled down to "we should have the mechanic, and close the server when admins aren't on"?

 

Because the two would go hand-in-hand with eachother. Zombie is boring as fuck right now and dont even try to tell me people actually look forward to being selected as MZ because they don't.  This is a solution to lazy inflating where you can be a starting 8 and not be ostracized for it, while also encouraging those to play as zombie by rewarding points. Why are you so scared of having zombies that know what they're doing? Humans can be as skilled as they want but no no no can't let zombies get too good or else the game isn't fun. Just listen to yourself that's ridiculous.

 

If hard maps tend to have more people inflating already why not take away their ability to dramatically lower the human chances by killing themselves mid round but instead making them a starting 8? How is that such an imbalance that it will become unplayable? You have 50 humans with guns, why should you get to brag when you beat a map but zombies can't feel accomplished for stopping you. You seem to be really concerned about this but since basically that's the only time you join to play I can't really take your input as gospel.

 

As for your last point.  I did say if maps have overpowered zombie items this feature should be turned off, but you don't need an admin on to toggle each time. If we can single out these what 5 maps (if that) from the rest it can be done automatically.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


No it doesn't work like that, I'm pretty sure having 8 pro zombies at the beginning of the round is more damaging to human chances verses having 8 pro zombies join in midround. And having the same group of pro zombies at the beginning of every single round kills variety, so if multiple rounds of losses leads to driving in the idea that the situation is hopeless for players. 

 

I hate to break it to you for like the 3rd time, there's a freaking reason why inflating was considered as a massive problem. It's because people saw it as an imbalance that made the game unplayable. You may not see it like that, but other players have had the experience where a few select players managed to drag enough rounds down until the session became a shit experience. And yes this became enough of an issue that the admins had to decide "no we cannot have this player play as a zombie every single round"

 

Also zombies will probably never feel as accomplished on winning on a tryhard map, and having players get to choose to play as zombie will not change any of that. Tryhard maps make it so zombie can put in minimal effort and win, and tryhard maps tend to have much more zombie wins than human wins. Human wins feel like an accomplishment because they are rare and they took alot of effort. If you wish to feel accomplished as a zombie you should go play on a map where humans win often because it will be harder for zombies to accomplish a win.

 

1 hour ago, DUSTY said:

Humans can be as skilled as they want but no no no can't let zombies get too good or else the game isn't fun. 

Unironically this. You think its a joke, but map deaths, server deaths have constantly been tied to zombies getting too good, but never the vice versa. Zombies become too good, humans end up never winning, players begin to leave the server and spam rtv as the session begins to drag on. Either way it becomes apparent that players are frustrated and not having fun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Good idea, the admin toggle on/off makes it even better (could also disable on certain maps instead). Don't need to debate everything, just add this feature and see what happens. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


12 hours ago, Chewie2k said:

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) this is the dumbest post ive seen , choosing to me a mz lmfao 

 

Exactly, because there is never a reason to play as zombie. I'd like to hear why zombie points were first implemented by Kim, and then why they were taken out by Delta. If the reason being people were inflating then did you ever consider that was because playing as a zombie was actually fun? Why you would be opposed to having both humans and zombies enjoy playing is beyond me. If I would rather get my points up because I couldn't care less about winning some FF map, then I would choose to be starting zombie and let more people who actually want to jump those lasers play as human. On top of that, If you fraction the points for non mother zombies then people would be less inclined to just die and inflate that way. Being afraid because zombies are too good is a joke. I'd rather have zombies who are interested then what it is now with these fake wins because 10 people are spectating doing absolutely nothing on the server and holding a slot. And yes, I am one of them. Make beating a map actually mean something again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Posted  Edited by Neiva

It's the bane of Zombie Escape unfortunately. Most people don't want to play as a Zombie and often go AFK or to spectate, ruining the experience for everyone else. Maps haven't helped this cause either as they're getting to 15-30 minutes long for a single stage and who wants to play as a zombie for that long?

 

NiDE CS:S server is a great example. Quite often there will be only 1 or 2 zombies actually playing and they die (or leave) and the round ends. The admins there actually have to force people onto a team as everybody goes spectator.

 

Then comes the other issue of people getting bored because there are no zombies to shoot and maps are becoming easier, so the server will decrease knockback or add to the mother zombie count... But then when all the zombies are playing, this creates an unbalance and zombies will win every time.

 

I don't know if there is a solution to this, perhaps kicking spectators more often and decrease the AFK timer.

Edited by Neiva

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


49 minutes ago, Neiva said:

I don't know if there is a solution to this, perhaps kicking spectators more often and decrease the AFK timer.

Do what DtK does, block people from spectating and add gameme points

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


6 hours ago, DUSTY said:

did you ever consider that was because playing as a zombie was actually fun?

You can make a human do the most mundane and menial work for a false sense of satisfaction and reward powered by imaginary points, hence why people copy funny posts to reupload on social media, I have seen people nail their fucking dick to a board just for reddit points.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


19 hours ago, Malal said:

Do what DtK does, block people from spectating and add gameme points

 

19 hours ago, Malal said:

You can make a human do the most mundane and menial work for a false sense of satisfaction and reward powered by imaginary points, hence why people copy funny posts to reupload on social media, I have seen people nail their fucking dick to a board just for reddit points.

 

 

Hmm, forgot about that. Definitely an option if it gets to that stage. People went nuts over the points on DtK as well, as far as inflating to get them.

 

4 hours ago, lce said:

Yea, cause DtK is doing soooooo well in terms of population with that system. In general it is going to be up the mappers to make it enjoyable for zombies and not having them sit in a cage for a 5 minute boss fight every round. On tryhard maps in general too, humans are the only ones that get any interesting items or if zombies get them, they are only in spawn so you don't get that neat mechanic if you get stabbed later. Adding points to something just encourages people to get them for bragging rights usually, not because they always enjoy grinding them out.

chrome_UtoQN8EUPB.png

 

DtK has many other issues that I won't discuss here (you can PM me if you want), but blocking spectate and having gameME points weren't it's downfall.


 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Posted  Edited by VIPBanana
21 hours ago, Malal said:

Do what DtK does, block people from spectating and add gameme points

 

DTK doesn't 'block' spectating, it's just that the server is shit and nothing is set up properly, which is why you should never use it as an example.

 

Mapeadores is a great example (regardless of it being P2W). It doesn't require hot garbage like TCU and doesn't have issues with players inflating to become zombies or avoiding becoming a zombie by joining spectator and having 20 retards circle jerking in spectate because they dislike a specific map.

 

6 hours ago, lce said:

Yea, cause DtK is doing soooooo well in terms of population with that system.

 

The system and way the server is set up have little to do with the population. There are far bigger issues with the community and the aus population is extremely small in CS:GO.

 

Meapadores also uses gameME and blocks spectate, yet they've always been the 2nd most popular Zombie Escape server. e74d6c96f3.png

 

The way servers are set up and whether or not they're garbage have little to no effect on the population. A great example is ZeddY's. 522a83a973.png

Edited by VIPBanana

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


I still think this is a good idea, this way we can reduce the mother zombie status join in the spec, this is a cancer in gfl, I have seen all mother zombies joining the spec in icescape map , only one mother zombie and more than 20 people.

Also, there should be punishment for people who join spec  (or left the server) when they are mother zombies

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


7 hours ago, lce said:

Yea, cause DtK is doing soooooo well in terms of population with that system. In general it is going to be up the mappers to make it enjoyable for zombies and not having them sit in a cage for a 5 minute boss fight every round. On tryhard maps in general too, humans are the only ones that get any interesting items or if zombies get them, they are only in spawn so you don't get that neat mechanic if you get stabbed later. Adding points to something just encourages people to get them for bragging rights usually, not because they always enjoy grinding them out.

chrome_UtoQN8EUPB.png

Are you inept?

1 hour ago, VIPBanana said:

DTK doesn't 'block' spectating, it's just that the server is shit and nothing is set up properly, which is why you should never use it as an example.

Did at one point.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×
×
  • Create New...